Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Senedo people - Wikipedia - Recent changes [en]

**'''Redirect''' is fine with me. [[User:Yuchitown|Yuchitown]] ([[User talk:Yuchitown|talk]]) 16:38, 25 January 2024 (UTC)Yuchitown

**'''Redirect''' is fine with me. [[User:Yuchitown|Yuchitown]] ([[User talk:Yuchitown|talk]]) 16:38, 25 January 2024 (UTC)Yuchitown

:<p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"><span style="color: #FF6600;">'''{{resize|91%|[[Wikipedia:Deletion process#Relisting discussions|Relisted]] to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}'''</span><br /><small>Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, <span style="font-family:Calibri; font-weight:bold;">[[User:Star Mississippi|<span style="color:#a117f2;">Star</span>]] [[User talk:Star Mississippi|<span style="color:#df00fe;">Mississippi</span>]]</span> 15:39, 25 January 2024 (UTC)</small><!-- from Template:XfD relist --></p>

:<p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"><span style="color: #FF6600;">'''{{resize|91%|[[Wikipedia:Deletion process#Relisting discussions|Relisted]] to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}'''</span><br /><small>Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, <span style="font-family:Calibri; font-weight:bold;">[[User:Star Mississippi|<span style="color:#a117f2;">Star</span>]] [[User talk:Star Mississippi|<span style="color:#df00fe;">Mississippi</span>]]</span> 15:39, 25 January 2024 (UTC)</small><!-- from Template:XfD relist --></p>

*The problem with the argument that we have sources now is exemplified thus: {{bquote|Following is a list of all of the known tribes residing in or resoring to the valley in 1716&ndash;1732 taken from Peyton's ''History of Augusta County'':<p>[&hellip;]<p>It is not known to what nation or tribe the Senedo belongs, as there is no reference to them in the older books; it is possible that the name was invented to account for the term Shenandoah [&hellip;]|{{cite book|title=Archeologic Investigations in James and Potomac Valleys|volume=23|series=Bulletin|publisher=[[ Smithsonian Institution]] Bureau of American Ethnology|issn=0081-0223|author1-first=Gerard|author1-last=Fowke|year=1894}}|p.72}} {{bquote|This name is mentioned because Kercheval wrote about a supposed tribe called Senedo. The source of his information was tradition. Numerous other writers have copied with amplification what he wrote about these Indians, who were supposed to have lived on the North Branch of the Shenandoah and who were reported exterminated by the Southern Indians in 1731 (Peyton's ''History of Augusta County''); some guess they were Cherokees and others presumed they were some other enemy tribe. If the Senedos ever existed they were exterminated before 1722, because at the Treaty of Albany (1722), Governor Spotswood expressly named each Indian tribe then living in Virginia, and the Senedoes were not among them. Furthermore, the Handbook of American indians published by the Bureau of American Athnology of the Smithsonian Institution dismisses references to the Senedoes as "of doubtful authenticity".|{{cite book|title=History of the Shenandoah Valley|volume=1|author1-first=William|author1-last=Couper|publisher=Lewis Historical Publishing Company|year=1952}}|p.122}} We have sources that do all of the AFD work for us. They tell us that there's ''just one source for this'', they name it, and they cast doubt upon its reliability and factual accuracy. I'll take {{plainlink|1=https://ead.lib.virginia.edu/vivaxtf/view?docId=vmi/vilxv00011.xml|2=William Couper, local historian who worked for the Virginia Military Institute in the 20th century}} over the 19th century source that he casts significant doubt upon. If we have modern scholarship that says that old scholarship is unreliable, then we really shouldn't be totalling up the 19th century regurgitations and declaring things notable, let alone doing what this article currently does which is presenting as true something that modern scholarship has concluded to be false.<p>[[User:Uncle G|Uncle G]] ([[User talk:Uncle G|talk]]) 18:14, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

*The problem with the argument that we have sources now is exemplified thus: {{bquote|Following is a list of all of the known tribes residing in or resoring to the valley in 1716&ndash;1732 taken from Peyton's ''History of Augusta County'':<p>[&hellip;]</p><p>It is not known to what nation or tribe the Senedo belongs, as there is no reference to them in the older books; it is possible that the name was invented to account for the term Shenandoah [&hellip;]|{{cite book|title=Archeologic Investigations in James and Potomac Valleys|volume=23|series=Bulletin|publisher=[[ Smithsonian Institution]] Bureau of American Ethnology|issn=0081-0223|author1-first=Gerard|author1-last=Fowke|year=1894}}|p.72}} {{bquote|This name is mentioned because Kercheval wrote about a supposed tribe called Senedo. The source of his information was tradition. Numerous other writers have copied with amplification what he wrote about these Indians, who were supposed to have lived on the North Branch of the Shenandoah and who were reported exterminated by the Southern Indians in 1731 (Peyton's ''History of Augusta County''); some guess they were Cherokees and others presumed they were some other enemy tribe. If the Senedos ever existed they were exterminated before 1722, because at the Treaty of Albany (1722), Governor Spotswood expressly named each Indian tribe then living in Virginia, and the Senedoes were not among them. Furthermore, the Handbook of American indians published by the Bureau of American Athnology of the Smithsonian Institution dismisses references to the Senedoes as "of doubtful authenticity".|{{cite book|title=History of the Shenandoah Valley|volume=1|author1-first=William|author1-last=Couper|publisher=Lewis Historical Publishing Company|year=1952}}|p.122}} We have sources that do all of the AFD work for us. They tell us that there's ''just one source for this'', they name it, and they cast doubt upon its reliability and factual accuracy. I'll take {{plainlink|1=https://ead.lib.virginia.edu/vivaxtf/view?docId=vmi/vilxv00011.xml|2=William Couper, local historian who worked for the Virginia Military Institute in the 20th century}} over the 19th century source that he casts significant doubt upon. If we have modern scholarship that says that old scholarship is unreliable, then we really shouldn't be totalling up the 19th century regurgitations and declaring things notable, let alone doing what this article currently does which is presenting as true something that modern scholarship has concluded to be false.</p><p>[[User:Uncle G|Uncle G]] ([[User talk:Uncle G|talk]]) 18:14, 26 January 2024 (UTC)</p>

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:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's [[Help:Talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this page.''<!--Template:Afd bottom--></div>

:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's [[Help:Talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this page.''<!--Template:Afd bottom--></div>