M
Masem
Guest
RD: Graham Greene: Reply
[td]*:::::::And for shows that have been lost to pop memory, cameo runs are clearly not uncontroversial since this allows for false additions. He was well known that I recognize a few of his appearances, but no way that the others can be easily checked in the way they are presented now. Hence why we need sources. [[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 17:16, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td] [td]*::::::::There was only one current comment about such roles on the talk page. An IP editor suggested that they appeared as Rosie's husband in [[North of 60]]. It was a simple matter to Google this and establish that the role had been played by another actor. What's required in such cases is [[fact-checking]], not fiddling with footnotes. A footnote doesn't verify because there's no guarantee that it matches the article's claim. What's actually required is a critical eye and careful checking of the claims against the evidence that's out there. But little of this seems to get done at ITN. Just looking for footnotes is [[cargo cult programming|cargo cult]] or [[Tick-box culture|check-box]] behaviour β just going by superficial appearances without the underlying competence and comprehension of the content. [[user:Andrew Davidson|Andrew]]
([[user talk:Andrew Davidson|talk]]) 22:02, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
[td]*::::::::There was only one current comment about such roles on the talk page. An IP editor suggested that they appeared as Rosie's husband in [[North of 60]]. It was a simple matter to Google this and establish that the role had been played by another actor. What's required in such cases is [[fact-checking]], not fiddling with footnotes. A footnote doesn't verify because there's no guarantee that it matches the article's claim. What's actually required is a critical eye and careful checking of the claims against the evidence that's out there. But little of this seems to get done at ITN. Just looking for footnotes is [[cargo cult programming|cargo cult]] or [[Tick-box culture|check-box]] behaviour β just going by superficial appearances without the underlying competence and comprehension of the content. [[user:Andrew Davidson|Andrew]]([[user talk:Andrew Davidson|talk]]) 22:02, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
[td]*:::::::::We're not expecting a thorough source evaluation but that there are sources cited. I still look over to make sure none of the sources scream as unreliable (like if they used IMDB), but I'm not going to sit there and verify each one for ITN, on the basis of good faith that the sources were added to support the fact. But the absence of sources, or providing more narrower definition of a primary source (like specific episodes rather than "one episodes" in a long series) on BLP pages is a result of years of lazy approaches to most entertainers articles when BLP demands better. [[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 04:02, 3 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
[td]*:::{{Reply|216.181.0.114}} Him being Indigenous/native is not relevant, from randomly searching I was able to find several examples of Indigenous/native people who were featured on recent deaths in the last few years: [[Ningali Lawford]] (2019), [[Fred Sasakamoose]] (2020), [[David Gulpilil]] (2021), [[Sean Wainui]] (2021), [[Jack Charles]] (2022), [[Lowitja O'Donoghue]] (2024), [[Cathy Merrick]] (2024), [[Jonathan Joss]] (2025), [[Takutai Tarsh Kemp]] (2025), [[Shane Christie]] (2025). [[User:Sahaib|Sahaib]] ([[User talk:Sahaib|talk]]) 15:37, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
[td]*:::{{Reply|216.181.0.114}} Him being Indigenous/native is not relevant, from randomly searching I was able to find several examples of Indigenous/native people who were featured on recent deaths in the last few years: [[Ningali Lawford]] (2019), [[Fred Sasakamoose]] (2020), [[David Gulpilil]] (2021), [[Sean Wainui]] (2021), [[Jack Charles]] (2022), [[Lowitja O'Donoghue]] (2024), [[Cathy Merrick]] (2024), [[Jonathan Joss]] (2025), [[Takutai Tarsh Kemp]] (2025), [[Shane Christie]] (2025). [[User:Sahaib|Sahaib]] ([[User talk:Sahaib|talk]]) 15:37, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td] [td]*'''Oppose''' an individual nomination is not the place to upend years of settled consensus on citation of the filmography. ''<small>[[User_talk:GreatCaesarsGhost|<span style="color:#938f8d">GreatCaesarsGhost</span>]]</small>'' 17:00, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
[td]*'''Oppose''' an individual nomination is not the place to upend years of settled consensus on citation of the filmography. ''<small>[[User_talk:GreatCaesarsGhost|<span style="color:#938f8d">GreatCaesarsGhost</span>]]</small>'' 17:00, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
Continue reading...
| Line 107: | Line 107: |
[td]
β Previous revision
[/td][td]
[td]*:::::::And for shows that have been lost to pop memory, cameo runs are clearly not uncontroversial since this allows for false additions. He was well known that I recognize a few of his appearances, but no way that the others can be easily checked in the way they are presented now. Hence why we need sources. [[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 17:16, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]Revision as of 04:02, 3 September 2025
[/td][td]*:::::::And for shows that have been lost to pop memory, cameo runs are clearly not uncontroversial since this allows for false additions. He was well known that I recognize a few of his appearances, but no way that the others can be easily checked in the way they are presented now. Hence why we need sources. [[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 17:16, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td] [td]*::::::::There was only one current comment about such roles on the talk page. An IP editor suggested that they appeared as Rosie's husband in [[North of 60]]. It was a simple matter to Google this and establish that the role had been played by another actor. What's required in such cases is [[fact-checking]], not fiddling with footnotes. A footnote doesn't verify because there's no guarantee that it matches the article's claim. What's actually required is a critical eye and careful checking of the claims against the evidence that's out there. But little of this seems to get done at ITN. Just looking for footnotes is [[cargo cult programming|cargo cult]] or [[Tick-box culture|check-box]] behaviour β just going by superficial appearances without the underlying competence and comprehension of the content. [[user:Andrew Davidson|Andrew]]
([[user talk:Andrew Davidson|talk]]) 22:02, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td][td]*::::::::There was only one current comment about such roles on the talk page. An IP editor suggested that they appeared as Rosie's husband in [[North of 60]]. It was a simple matter to Google this and establish that the role had been played by another actor. What's required in such cases is [[fact-checking]], not fiddling with footnotes. A footnote doesn't verify because there's no guarantee that it matches the article's claim. What's actually required is a critical eye and careful checking of the claims against the evidence that's out there. But little of this seems to get done at ITN. Just looking for footnotes is [[cargo cult programming|cargo cult]] or [[Tick-box culture|check-box]] behaviour β just going by superficial appearances without the underlying competence and comprehension of the content. [[user:Andrew Davidson|Andrew]]
([[user talk:Andrew Davidson|talk]]) 22:02, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
[td]*:::::::::We're not expecting a thorough source evaluation but that there are sources cited. I still look over to make sure none of the sources scream as unreliable (like if they used IMDB), but I'm not going to sit there and verify each one for ITN, on the basis of good faith that the sources were added to support the fact. But the absence of sources, or providing more narrower definition of a primary source (like specific episodes rather than "one episodes" in a long series) on BLP pages is a result of years of lazy approaches to most entertainers articles when BLP demands better. [[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 04:02, 3 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
[td]*:::{{Reply|216.181.0.114}} Him being Indigenous/native is not relevant, from randomly searching I was able to find several examples of Indigenous/native people who were featured on recent deaths in the last few years: [[Ningali Lawford]] (2019), [[Fred Sasakamoose]] (2020), [[David Gulpilil]] (2021), [[Sean Wainui]] (2021), [[Jack Charles]] (2022), [[Lowitja O'Donoghue]] (2024), [[Cathy Merrick]] (2024), [[Jonathan Joss]] (2025), [[Takutai Tarsh Kemp]] (2025), [[Shane Christie]] (2025). [[User:Sahaib|Sahaib]] ([[User talk:Sahaib|talk]]) 15:37, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td][td]*:::{{Reply|216.181.0.114}} Him being Indigenous/native is not relevant, from randomly searching I was able to find several examples of Indigenous/native people who were featured on recent deaths in the last few years: [[Ningali Lawford]] (2019), [[Fred Sasakamoose]] (2020), [[David Gulpilil]] (2021), [[Sean Wainui]] (2021), [[Jack Charles]] (2022), [[Lowitja O'Donoghue]] (2024), [[Cathy Merrick]] (2024), [[Jonathan Joss]] (2025), [[Takutai Tarsh Kemp]] (2025), [[Shane Christie]] (2025). [[User:Sahaib|Sahaib]] ([[User talk:Sahaib|talk]]) 15:37, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td] [td]*'''Oppose''' an individual nomination is not the place to upend years of settled consensus on citation of the filmography. ''<small>[[User_talk:GreatCaesarsGhost|<span style="color:#938f8d">GreatCaesarsGhost</span>]]</small>'' 17:00, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
[td]*'''Oppose''' an individual nomination is not the place to upend years of settled consensus on citation of the filmography. ''<small>[[User_talk:GreatCaesarsGhost|<span style="color:#938f8d">GreatCaesarsGhost</span>]]</small>'' 17:00, 2 September 2025 (UTC)[/td]
Continue reading...
